This is disheartening. It appears that RationalWiki has been overrun by baboons. Or at the very least, is performing nothing near due diligence in its editing oversight.
By now, most people should be aware of Thunderf00t’s brief, but spectacular, tenure at the Fox News of the godless world, freefromthoughtblogs, the embers of which are still flaring and showing little sign of subsiding.
I don’t won’t to go into the history or the rights and wrongs of that conflagration1. Suffice it to say it was a joy to watch, and one of several key recent episodes that are precipitating the baboon eschaton and nudging them towards the abyss they so richly deserve.
What I do want to look at is an item that popped up in one of my RSS feeds pointing to a biographical article on Thunderf00t at RationalWiki –
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Thunderf00t
[Pastehtml mirror as of the time of this writing, August 19]
Now I’ve always looked at RW.org as one of the more reliable sites on the web2 – one of those rare ones you could have confidence in referring to without getting a second citation for most things. Unfortunately, I don’t think I will have the same degree of confidence any more. Yes, I will do that loathsome practice of mining it for quotes, but I do recommend having a look at the full article pointers above for yourselves. Things are already looking grim by the second paragraph –
…and his falling out with Freethought Blogs after he decided to let out his inner cluelessness on women’s rights in public. Sound familiar?
“Cluelessness” leads to an article on one of FfTB‘s favourite curse words, “MRA”, which makes some superficial effort at objectivity, but can’t resist baboonising it with choice lines like –
Since they haven’t gained much influence as of yet, their activity seems to be mostly limited to whining about the “feminazis” or “femtards” on the internet… If you don’t eat beef jerky for every meal, idolize Chuck Norris, and tell your bitch to make you a damn sandwich, you’re probably a mangina and responsible for the ongoing “feminization” of our society.
Rational stuff. But whatever doubts about the current state of RW.org‘s integrity may be aroused thus far get a whole lot more doubtful with the “Sound familiar?” link that follows, which backs up and empties a manure truck all over TheAmazingAtheist/TJ Kincaid…
At this point I’m feeling kinda foolish about ever saying RW.org was a “reliable site”. And I am also wondering about the site’s mission statement that, amongst other things, claims to have the the lofty goal of “providing [articles that] are factually accurate and of interest to the community at large”.
It only gets worse from here. The section of key interest is Thunderf00t at Freethought Blogs. Again, I’m mining selectively, but I encourage folks to view the linked source for themselves –
Apparently, he made the mistake of assuming that if something is uninteresting to him, it is not important [with link to article on “privilege”3]… After the first exchange of posts, Thunderf00t went into CAPSLOCK MODE in order to prove how correct he was… Extensive criticism in the comments — including by people who had actually written the policy — indicated that he didn’t give a fuck about the issues involved. By this time, his blog had attracted a number of anti-feminist and/or anti-FtB commenters, who had trolled everybody else at FtB [no doubt meaning ERV]… Kicking Thunderf00t off turned out to be a rather good idea, especially in light of Tf00t’s unauthorized resubscription to the backchannel mailing list and subsequent release of emails discussing him after his firing. Jason Thibeault explains how he did it and mentions that the security issue has now been fixed; essentially, it allowed thunderf00t to re-subscribe, which he did less than 10 minutes after he was kicked off. Yep, Phil is not the messiah he’s a very naughty boy.
Fascinating and informative stuff. I now know that the “security issue” that has been “fixed” is baboon speak for “administrator incompetence”, f’rinstance. But seriously, there is nil information about the actual story that unfolded and the whole section is little more than a protracted trowelling of Thunderf00t whilst portraying FfTB in an innocent victim’s light. It completely omits the critical parts of the story, like the fact that Thunderf00t’s posts had not been removed because even now, long after his ejection, they were still earning more revenue than the next 10 top blogs after Pharyngula. Screw principle, this is business. And it also omits Brayton essentially wanting to renege paying Thunderf00t any of the earnings he is owed. Details, details… Can’t let those get in the way of a good lynching can we? Nothing however, beats the ultimate insult of linking to Lousy Canuck/Thibeault, the homo-hater, for full “authoritative” information about the whole debacle…
Of course, wikis are wikis. They are (usually) free for anyone to edit and the price you pay for this versatility is that the occasional beat up will go unnoticed. And this caveat allows the wiki admins a period of grace to be notified of gross misuse and to rectify it. In an ideal world anyway. This is where the sewer starts to really reek.
The articles Talk page makes for some very interesting reading –
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Thunderf00t
[Pastehtml mirror as of the time of this writing, August 19]
The following entry makes for the most disturbing reading –
Everything PZ and FtB does is “right”? Anything tfoot did is “wrong”? No middle ground? Just checking here. I spent a fair amount of time editing the FTB paragraph to make it sound, uh, rational, and then some drive-by gangsta comes in and reverses my edits. I guess I could reverse his, and then we have a shooting war. So, just let me know if this wiki is a FTB haven and everything that PZ says is The Word Made Flesh. Do the facts matter at all, or is this just an EmotionWiki? —Petzl (talk) 07:28, 15 July 2012 (UTC)
Sounds all so terribly familiar. It is difficult to come to any conclusion other than that RationalWiki is no longer its own entity and is really little more than an extension of the freefromthoughtblogs propaganda mill.
As I said at the start of this article, this is disheartening, to put it quite mildly. In real terms, this means that RationalWiki can no longer be trusted or relied on, and that the assumption must be made that any information in it beyond the explanation of basic terminology is tainted. Do the folks that run RW.org care? Or are they really in cahoots with the baboons and sucking ass for acceptance?
Whatever the case, the general axiom in the godless and skeptic communities is that it takes far longer to build a credible reputation than it does to destroy it. Does this cause any concern to RationalWiki? If so, they need to regain a semblance of control. For the record, here is their full mission statement –
Mission
- Analyzing and refuting pseudoscience and the anti-science movement.
- Documenting the full range of crank ideas.
- Explorations of authoritarianism and fundamentalism.
- Analysis and criticism of how these subjects are handled in the media.
We welcome contributors, and encourage those who disagree with us to register and engage in constructive dialogue.
We also have a fifth, unofficial purpose, which is to provide people who agree with the previously-stated goals a place to just hang out and have fun with like-minded people.
RationalWiki is not a general encyclopedia; it does not require articles on every known subject. However, the wiki’s mainspace welcomes many articles that do not relate to the primary missions of RationalWiki providing that they are factually accurate and of interest to the community at large. These include articles on general science, historical events and important individuals throughout the world.
1 – OK, I will, but briefly and I will not discuss this further here. Thunderf00t is right, the baboons are wrong. End of story. They now have two assholes to shit out of and it was a joy to watch. Even the absurdity of the mailing list “hack” (that was nothing of the sort) is nowhere near the evil that it is painted to be – not a whole lot worse than when you get a crossed telephone line on someone else’s conversation and instead of hanging up, you keep on listening out of morbid curiosity. The whole “hack” hyperbole had one purpose and one purpose only – to deflect from the issue at hand: that FfTB is corrupt to the very core and serves no ones interests other than Brayton’s and Myers’.
2 – I know. I’m a naive a gullible shmuck. I accept that charge. Rub it in and get over it. In my defence, I have only ever used RW.org for terminology look ups, never for reference material.
3 -Which contains that classic line “Remember – if you have the luxury of only thinking about privilege sometimes, odds are good that you have a fair amount of it.”
August 20, 2012 at 3:08 am
The talk page was informative. They’re biased and proud of it, watching over that still-born offspring like a mentally anguished mother hen; learned behavior from their defense of gender feminism as “equality politics”.
Whenever I consider putting a post or comment together, laying out point-by-point in clearest terms why this shit is self-defeating and hypocritical, I realize it’s been done. And done, and done, and done. One would think that having the professional philosophers line up on one side of the issue would give the other side pause in espousing the “rational” party line, but alas. . .
Time and again, FTB acts like a fork in the road; some minds, like TF, spot the rotten smell two seconds in the door, while others, like ZOMG, become double-speak replicas like a scene from The Thing.
August 20, 2012 at 8:32 am
Zomg is very clear about her loyalties. To her, revenue tops credibility. She deletes anyone suggesting this on her channel and now she’s painfully trying to adhere to the ftb thought police whilst at the same time looking rational and independent. I predict that she will either become a full blown baboon within a year or she’ll get into trouble. Scented Nectar said she’d get away with more because she’s a girl so perhaps she won’t be banned.
Either way, I say that, by this time next year, Zomg will be indistinguishable from the other baboons.
August 20, 2012 at 3:41 am
More and more I notice that “rational” is usually an umbrella term used to describe quasi-Marxist (“oppressed” vs. “privileged” classes) left-wing horseshit.
This is where RationalWiki’s true colors start to show:
Suspicious!
August 20, 2012 at 7:25 am
The term “rational” has been stolen by people who assume that being correct is a movement unto itself. I hate the term “rationalist”, because it presumes that anyone who isn’t a rationalist is irrational; the same way that feminism assumes that non-feminism is sexist.
It’s taking skepticism and turning it on its head. You’re supposed to question each other’s views, not blindly agree with each other.
Look at what the Blag Hag wrote:
http://freethoughtblogs.com/blaghag/2012/08/how-i-unwittingly-infiltrated-the-boys-club-why-its-time-for-a-new-wave-of-atheism/
If you can make it through her drivel about Boobquake and the astonishing revelation that men want to see boobs, you’ll find a point at which she starts babbling about the need for a new atheist movement and how the feminists are “already winning”, because, as she claims, the “hater” comments are “now vastly outnumbered by supportive comments”.
Look at how she takes comfort in being surrounded by people who don’t challenge her on her bullshit. Look at all the lies she gets away with in her blog post when there’s no one there to point out that Thunderfoot didn’t drop docs on anyone.
Look at how she repeats the assertion that Rebecca Watson gets daily rape threats in her email, something that is far more likely to be the work of trolls from 4Chan and ED than anyone in the atheist community.
See what happens when the Newer Atheists have no one to challenge them? They feel safe.
August 20, 2012 at 7:41 am
Step 1: assume feminist ideology is rainbows and kittens.
Step 2: ban people who disagree
Step 3: Ignore step 2, and call a shift in the remaining comments “success” attributable to the truth of feminism.
It’s a joy to have our own presuppositionalists.
August 20, 2012 at 11:46 am
@PMP – Blog Hog let’s slip and exposes her actual agenda –
See? It wasn’t about atheism at all.
August 21, 2012 at 4:11 am
Well, we already know that she’s a liar.
She’s still carrying on about the Reddit photo, even though those are clearly not representative of the male attendants of TAM, where for the second year in a row, virtually nothing of any consequence actually happened. (except for that SCARY T-SHIRT!!!!)
And all of her references are to Sepchick and FfTB, so that you never have to actually see the full context of what any of their critics are saying. For example, Paula Kirby’s use of the words “feminazi” and “femistasi” are mentioned, along with a link to an article written by the Baboon Princess, where it is assumed, without proof, that Paula is literally calling feminists Nazis and Stasis. Kirby is then compared to Rush Limbaugh, as if that’s not a shame-by-association tactic. (Let’s all pause for a moment to bask in the irony.)
Unfortunately for these idiots, by the time Blag Hag posted this nonsense, Paula Kirby already had a solid rebuttal.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B02RDDb71N8Xc2EwYmw5T2Z4eDg/edit
It’d be nice to get a rebuttal from SepticChick and Fraud Thought Blogs, but I don’t intend to hold my breath.
May 10, 2021 at 7:00 am
Lol, you snowflakes are so triggered. It must piss you off so much that you’ll never, ever, not even once in your life get laid. Talk about a bunch of turbo virgins. Kill yourselves, you’re a waste of space and nobody on the planet wants you. Not even your own fucking mothers want you.
August 20, 2012 at 7:49 am
Why did you like to justin biebers twitter? Is there some joke I’m not getting there?
August 20, 2012 at 11:44 am
The Slymepit just calls him Bieber because a) he’s canuck, b) he looks like him and c) no one can be bothered to spell his name properly
August 20, 2012 at 8:53 pm
Also very convenient that they like to attack tf00t for “unauthorized access to a computer system” but conveniently ignore watson’s commission of that crime for real. https://greylining.com/2011/09/10/why-rebecca-watson-is-a-criminal/
I have doubts that RW.org pointed this out (i refuse to taint my connection by connecting to it to check). I even tried pointing this out myself on Tf00t’s blog comments to no avail. All I got was ignored, deflections and excuses. Not to mention that time when PZ barged in uninvited to a phone call with creationists talking about Expelled uninvited, which is actually closer to what Tf00t did.
I guess it’s all OK if you’re on the “right” side. Hypocrisy, the lifeblood of FfTB and skepchick.
August 20, 2012 at 9:44 pm
Quawonk: Also very convenient that they like to attack tf00t for “unauthorized access to a computer system” but conveniently ignore watson’s commission of that crime for real.
Yeah, well that’s why I said I didn’t want to delve into all the details, because it’s a bottomless pit. However, for your delectation, Patricia Marie Fowler, 18 months in federal prison, $17,000 restitution, followed by 3 years supervised release after jail term – for doing pretty much what Watson did at randi.org –
https://www.fbi.gov/tampa/press-releases/2010/ta120710.htm
And there’s assholes saying what TF did is worse. Ostriches and sand.
August 21, 2012 at 2:56 pm
Atheism+
It’s all the new rage on FfTB.
August 21, 2012 at 3:02 pm
Well, I have the copyright on Atheism*∞, the be all and end all, and I’ll DMCA-rmageddon anyone that copies it. This is my logo, which is much cooler than theirs will ever be –
August 26, 2012 at 11:15 am
That’s like all hip ‘n stuff.
When will they bring out their version of Mecca-Cola (with breast milk of course)?
May 10, 2021 at 6:58 am
That’s fucking stupid, and you’re fucking stupid. Your logo is shit and you aren’t clever. Kill yourself.
August 21, 2012 at 10:06 pm
A+ sounds like a little girls club where they can all hold hands and sing songs while sitting on fluffy pink clouds and bunnies and not have even the slightest negativity in their life, especially not any disagree-ers.
That’s the world these fembots want to live in.
August 23, 2012 at 9:19 am
A+ really picking up steam over there now. Will Dawkins let them use his symbol A? Stay tuned for the next episode of this unfolding soap opera…
August 23, 2012 at 5:37 pm
You should check out the word “Sexism” over there on Rationalwiki.. its pretty hilarious, as well as MRA itself.
August 28, 2012 at 2:11 am
It’s a wiki; go edit it, rather than whining. Duh.
August 28, 2012 at 10:51 am
Let’s descend to freefromthought blogs repartee – “you are a fucking moron”. Quote from the RW.org talk page, as you are far too busy and important to actually read what I wrote –
May 10, 2021 at 6:56 am
Kill yourself, dumbass. You’re not clever or useful or even wanted.
September 8, 2012 at 9:12 pm
Those FfTB idiots are engaging in tactics that most religious cults employ when they’re confronted with a viewpoint that they don’t agree with: censor anything that is critical of them, ignore any evidence of aggressive behaviour, and believe that everything they say or do is made of sunshine and rainbows. Those FfTB people are completely crazy.
April 2, 2013 at 9:51 am
Ha.. Turns out that RationalWiki baboons have an entry for ERV as well. in a section called Sexist simpletons: MRAS, MGTOWS, PUAS and Nice Guys/Incels/AFCs
August 26, 2013 at 12:50 am
THE WHOLE DAMN WORLD IS OVERRUN BY MENSTRUAL FEMINIST BABOONS ! WHO DONT KNOW THAT THEY ARE TOO UGLY TO BE RAPED, EVER !
August 26, 2013 at 12:39 pm
Very good. Prime example of this –
http://www.news.com.au/technology/uk-schoolgirl-hannah-smith-sent-hate-mail-to-herself-before-committing-suicide/story-e6frfro0-1226695227562
Poor Becky Watson has a problem – comments like this simply don’t exist on the blogs of those that criticise the Pudgy Pink Princess. Critics don’t capslock and have an unfortunate degree of erudition. Watch this screencap pop up in Watson’s “evidence” file. This piece looks more SallyStrange than “hater”.
May 10, 2021 at 6:55 am
“I’m a good person but all women should be raped!” You’re a fucking piece of shit. This is why nobody gives a crap about you idiots bawwwwwing your eyes out. Kill yourself.
May 10, 2014 at 2:56 am
I’ve learned that you shouldn’t trust people’s opinions of themselves. It’s easy to call yourself rational. It’s not like people who disagree with their views are saying, “I think I want to be irrational so I’ll be a republican who believes in god and free market economics, because I don’t want to be rational.” Assuming your view must be rational and other people’s views are irrational is a very irrational point of view in my opinion.
How about I start a webpage called “imright.com” and everything I say there must be right because it’s in the title.
Yea, I browsed through rational-wiki and found it to be biased crap in my opinion.
August 30, 2014 at 11:30 pm
The essential problem with RationalWiki.org is that the articles are unsigned. One therefore has no idea of the qualifications of the authors. It is especially annoying for this site to call legitimate scientific theories “pseudoscience.”
September 4, 2014 at 12:22 pm
It is a pit of ideological gibberish. Bar a few reasonable explanations of fallacies and stuff, it is raw crap. It is a moral obligation of any skeptic/freethinker to advertise this fact and discourage people linking it as a reference.
May 15, 2015 at 9:21 am
Interesting. Could you provide links to example articles that typify this “ideological gibberish” and that “call legitimate scientific theories ‘pseudoscience”? P.S. Wikipedia has this problem as well.
May 15, 2015 at 12:40 pm
Look up Thunderfoot or gamergate or basically anyone who as dissented from the orthodox narrative (even me). Particularly interesting are the Talk pages where editors openly admit they have no interest in facts that contradict official ideology.
May 16, 2015 at 9:14 am
In fact:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Balance_fallacy
“Wikipedia avoids the balance fallacy (to some degree) with its policy of not giving undue weight to minority viewpoints or fringe theories in its articles. RationalWiki, on the other hand, avoids the balance fallacy by calling fringe theories bullshit from start to finish.[6]”
“[6]↑ A notable exception is Jesus mythicism, considered a fringe position on Wikipedia, but respected on RationalWiki, for good reasons. As critics of Historical Jesus research have pointed out, most “experts” who insist on a HJ are New Testament researchers who are primarily theologists and literature experts with some historical training, and overwhelmingly Christian or formerly Christian, while secular professional historians whose research focuses on ancient history tend to be less insistent. Moreover, the multitude of often mutually radically contradictory conceptions about the HJ is highly unusual for people whose historical existence is secure and does not inspire confidence in the field, as does the employment of authenticity criteria unique to biblical studies. In contrast, Socrates researchers admit to the serious difficulties with attempts to reconstruct details about the historical Socrates and his teachings much more readily, even though the evidence for him is much better, which is why his historical existence is not controversial. While Jesus mythicism admittedly attracts lots of crackpots and shoddy arguments, there are quite sane, competent and methodically rigorous HJ sceptics and even outright advocates of mythicism, such as Doherty and Carrier, who tend to be quite annoyed by low-quality mythicism, and many secular sceptics feel that it is the HJ research, that, even though respected in the mainstream, is almost equally bullshit as some of the more outlandish variations on the Jesus myth theory.”
May 16, 2015 at 9:38 pm
And the point of this comment is?
December 25, 2014 at 2:28 am
Most of what I read at RationalWiki was a regular visit to the Clogosphere. Now that is littered with promoting feminism by the Argument from Ridicule. For instance, a professor is accused of postmodernism for quoting Sarkeesian adequately and pointing out how she contradicts herself. Or when it wants you to read how ridiculous some MHRAs have said it does not link to the primary source but links to Futrelle’s We Hunted the Mammoth for a rehash. Or when it wastes space with an article by Roosh Vorek showing how vain he is. This was supposed to be a website on antiscience trends.
For a while people were voting those down but such people have stopped reading it or like me, go there less often.
April 7, 2015 at 1:59 pm
RationalWiki has gone downhill since David Gerard ingratiated himself as their newly appointed admin. I find it ironic that self-confessed vampire goth fantasist is now running that website. Says it all really.
April 7, 2015 at 4:29 pm
Know much about who else is running it? It is not just gibberish – it is organised and directed propaganda. There is nothing random about it – it reminds me of how loopy religious thinktanks operate. Claim to not be religious yet every manipulation is religiously motivated.
February 4, 2017 at 5:44 pm
RationalWiki is like Scientology. If you express having even the slightest of doubt about any of their articles, you will be marked as a “repressive” person and all your edits will be undone.
Now, if anyone says that you aren’t 100% insane, will also be marked as a “repressive” person and all his edits will be undone too.
May 10, 2021 at 6:51 am
Lol, you dumbass snowflakes are so triggered. Thunderfoot’s an idiot, and so are all of you for blindly following his hate train. You’re no better than the people you claim to be against. Fucking retards.